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Looks like a very beautiful building. Obviously it is not for investment but for end buyers who can afford it.
I second that. Beautiful everything. Inside this flat is better than Apogee. But I have an issue with living on the Brickell Key. Not one but two bottle necks before going to SOBE. The first is the Brickell Key bridge and the second is the Brickell Draw Bridge. And I don’t like the secluded feel of the Island. But to each their own.
VERY VERY NICE.Still a little high priced though.
“ASIA” Does that mean they use Chinese Drywall 8 )
AJ, I think the YUP Brickell Key people move there to be away from SOBE for the most part anyway, so that probably won’t matter for them. Anyway, how can you not like an area that has a Courvoisier Courts.
People should be willing to pay twice that for the ability to be around such services and people.
Mr. Whinston don’t think like a pauper!!!
Lucas said “The unit also comes with a private storage room located right outside the unit.”
That should be mandatory for every “HI-End” condo. Amazing how little storage space you have in some of these 1mill+ condos.
“a large 2 bedroom unit with 2,745 square feet of interior space”
If the SF is accurate, that’s an amazing amount of SF for a 2BR down here. Must give a very different feel than other condos as the common rooms must be supersized. Even though that’s amazing for now, any future development would be smart to go that way. We’ve got enough 1,000 SF 2BR’s to last till 2050.
JL,
Yes, There are a lot of people who will pay for that kind of exclusivity. But I did not see any affordable grocery stores or restaurants on Brickell Key. Everything is high end. No Salad Creations or Daily News kind of joints. That is a problem. Even if you are rolling in cash, you still want to get down the elevator and be able to go to a place like News Cafe. Even Gianni Versace used to go to such a down market place daily.
I for one would like to live among action or activity and not in seclusion. If not I will grow old and die at an accelerated pace. But that is me.
You are absolutely correct about the storage. It should be a minimum mandatory thing on high end buildings. (I can hear – there you go again about 1800) But bear with me, in 18, apart from common storage spaces on the garage deck, there are 4 storage rooms on each floor ranging from 100 to 200 sf and are very reasonably priced. One can buy on the same floor to supplement their flat space. I do not know if there is an option to buy storage rooms on the same floor in other buildings. Can someone educate us?
What is up with the pool? I dont know about you but one of the nicer things in Miami is the weather and being able to get some sun throughout the year. This pool is directly under the building, I would expect much more if I were paying over a Mil for an apt.
i think that this building should of been built right on the beach. its way prettier than continuum 2 ….nd the penthouse is really unique , but then again im just a kid !! I dont know much about this stuff !
im a kid, but this stuff is really interesting . what i cant figure out , is how miami approved that all these new buildings could be built. They could of not possibly thought , there were this many people out there wanting 2 live in a condo in miami, and if i( my parents) were going to spend half a mil for a condo, they would at least want it on the beach. Im not saying that i don’t love these buildings, they are AWESOME nd it would b so tight ( cool) 2 live in one, but i thought u were supposed to TEST the market or something , Did the first condos of the boom sell out ?? is that what made the developers rush to build? i mean this is serious overdeveloping……… right ??am i correct?
Brando,
The pool is indeed a little funny. It is tiny and like someones personal pool. Also built under a portico. I think they have a lack of space around that building. I have been there. There is a nice walk along the water and a nice driveway as you can see from the pic. Maybe that’s why they gave a resistance pool as there is no lap pool. So only one at a time can swim laps. But the old coots who can afford 1.5 million for a flat are less interested in doing laps I guess.
How many units to a floor?? HOA per mo? Did it have a den/office area? The shower was odd being in front of a window—bath no way compares to Apogee.
Richard, right about the bath. Any Lech in One Miami will have a field day watching through a binoculars!
In line 02 in Quantum, one of the bathrooms has a full length window in front of the bath tub. But you look out mostly into the water. That is like a dream, showering and looking out into the water. But looking into One Miami or Met 1 from Asia’s bath room is a different story. May be some self conscious owners are frosting the bottom half of the glass! But a window in a bath room not facing any people is a sheer luxury. 90% buildings do not have a window in the bath room.
I have never seen so many ovens in a kitchen anywhere. What are they trying to make?
I looked at Apogees pics. They have very nice baths and kitchens. But also 3 to 4 times more expensive than Asia. But Asia’s stuff is good stuff too.
If I have 1.5 Mil, I will buy in Continuum II, even though I will get less Sq footage there.
This will be my last post on bath rooms (I know makes me think hates talking about the loo too much). The Apogee Unit I researched has clear and direct view of Government cut from the bath room. That means any passing cruise ship passenger will have a good view of Apogee bathroom activities with the help of a binoculars (and most are carrying one).
Point to ponder.
Singularly unimpressive. The finishes look drab, the location is nice enough. The price (it’s quantum especially) silly.
Wow, this building and unit look very nice.
AJ(13),
The 4 appliances you see are not all ovens. If they are Miele, I have the same combination at home: a Double oven, a microwave, and a capuccino maker.
I also have a warming drawer, which is probably located under the combination you see in this kitchen.
For the window in the shower, you can probably use a bipolar film that will allow you to see outside but will block the view from outside. They work well during day light, not sure at night.
Lucas, nice work with the site. I am an avid reader.
Sa
Nice building. Nice unit. Nothing negative to say about this one. I prefer this area over South Beach. Much more upscale.
Maybe I’m not a condo kind of guy but it all looks fairly ugly to me….
Lucas I think you should (a) use more lighting, (b) buy a better camera, or (c) hire a professional photographer. Sometimes I think your pics have a counterproductive effect–they can make great buildings look average and average buildings look like crap.
Just caught this ” The living room of unit 703 with 12-foot ceilings:”
Very nice touch, compared to the 9-foot high cave condos at Jorge’s Murano Grande and Icon and Icon Brickell (not sure on this last one but I assume all Related builds follow the same forumla)
AA said “Lucas I think you should (a) use more lighting, (b) buy a better camera, or (c) hire a professional photographer”
I would like to put in the record (d)
(d) Throw in a bunch of bikini girls from the Flamingo pool. (That should make your photos look much better)
On further thought, if the unit is 12′ high all around. I have to give a standing ovation.
It will feel/look dramatic compared to any other condo on the market and most who see it probably won’t understand why. This is why, 9′ tall Murano Grande, 10′ tall Apogee and Continuum. This is one condo that probably surprises to the upside in person.
JL,
Brilliant observation! But how could the living room be 12′ and the rest of the house be 9′ or 10′? Architecturally it is not possible. At least not in a condo building. But take a look at the kitchen. It looks standard height to me. Can someone explain this paradox!? The flat above and below will have lots of step ups and step downs if it is true.
If indeed the unit is 12′ all around, then it is like a semi loft (with loft being considered anything 16′ and over) and hence a real VFM as you are getting more cubic feet for the given price per square feet.
Wow that unit is awesome! Brickell Key is one of my favorite areas in Miami. Very upscale and intimate feeling. Now I just need to get my hands on 1.5M of stimulus money.
AJ, kitchens , baths, sometimes hallways have lower ceilings very frequently. There needs to be room for mechanical chases, plumbing and hvac. Not every ceiling will be 12′, but my guess is that living rooms and bedrooms have them.
This is a very beautiful building.
The pool area looks like something offered by a Hampton Inn. They should have scrapped the tennis court and put a nice big lagoon Asian style pool there. Residents can use the Brickell tennis club or key biscayne if they like tennis. Don’t short change the pool area.
agree with the comments regarding the tennis courts. not a wise use of space and money for the community at large. prefer a nice lounge or park area, or even improved pool amenities. but i guess i could suffer the tennis courts if needed.
that said, this is a great building. i can only dream of living there! fantastic views of the water, own private secluded island, what more could one ask for? this is what a luxury building should look like-take note all you developers out there who try to pass the recent construction as luxury. my guess is even AJ would trade his beloved 1800 for an Asia in a heartbeat!
gables, you are right except that I am not much of a seclusionist or isolationist. If only it had Pace Park like activity in front or around the building, that would complete my life. The last few times I went to the key, all I saw was some nanny pushing the masters kid around and cars with rolled up windows coming in and going out. That is kind of deppressing for me not to see much human activity. I understand that some people will pay a lot of premium for such exclusivity but I like to be among living breathing humans.
Oh Yeah, if we can swap out 1800 with Asia, I will take Asia anyday. All we need is a superman that can dig out the building with its foundations and place it in front of Pace Park! I am a swimmer and as far as laps are concerned, I got to buy one of the Wild Bills cloned key fobs to gain access to other buildings to swim.
If someone here could share some insights in re to Homestead area of Miami. AJ I know you spoke not very favorably about the area, There are some great cashflowing opportunities there with section 8. Just want your opinion about the area and how dangerous or peaceful it is.
AJ, by “Pace Park like activity” are you referring to the hookers, dealers or junkies?
Public parks tend to attract the lowest of the low. Dog owners.
Actually last time I was in Brickell Key with the family was quite enjoyable. We had dinner at Cafe Sambal. It was a humid summer night but we decided to walk around the island. Very peaceful yet there were people jogging, roller blading and bicycling around the island path. Just enough that I was pleasantly surprised. It felt very safe and away from it all. The views from the island are fantastic. It would be my second choice in Miami. First being SoFi.
Lara,
Homestead is as good as any other middle of the Florida towns. Someone vacationing in the Keys often will have it very convenient there. Other than that, the commute to Miami or SOBE will be a pain. The only negative thing I said about Homestead is that “half the town is on sale”.
Candela,
Welcome back for your once in a six month post! That too to kick my Pace Park in the stomach.
I like to know where you hang out in Miami. I can’t seem to find the hookers, dealers and Junkies anywhere even if I try. I do see the home less people in SOBE. That’s it.
It is like a friend of mine told me, ” I went to Amsterdam with great expectations to see punks, goths, kids with coloured mohawks and all kinds of alternate lifestyles and to my utter disappointment none are to be found”. My wonderment about your description of Pace Park is the same.
I don’t know if one is necessarily an isolationist or seclusionist if they choose to live on Brickell Key. Perhaps they just enjoy security and cleanliness. Many young couples with children choose to live on Brickell Key for those reasons. They’d be committing child neglect by raising children in that Pace Park neighborhood.
Is Ansel Adams one of the “SMART MONEY” boys???Sounds like it to me.
Aj doesn’t even live in pace park or 1800. I don’t know why he keeps posting like an expert. The area is not that great. Better than what it was 10 years ago but still seedy. Aj do you know why omni mall closed down? Ask around and you will be enlightened
Drew,
Yeah right, You want to raise a recluse with no people skills or street smartness, go ahead. Don’t call the children around Pace Park neglected. They are growing up with the times of their lives playing in the childrens park enclosure, thank you.
IRR,
there are quite a few reasons why OMNI closed and location is not one of them. It is just very unique and ahead of its time. Read all about OMNI in Wikipedia. It will give you a good idea about what happened. It is reopening as OMNI offices and shops.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Omni_International_Mall
And as far as your charge about not living there but posting like an expert, this is what I have to say: How come you never posted anything about where you live? I read your post almost like 5 months ago. That is a terrible waste. Someone who posts once every few months has to post something negative and not something useful or constructive.
And believe you me, an interested party like me who lives a thousand miles away knows more about some place than someone living there. You cannot believe how many clue less people are in my own building who know jack nothing about anything miami or their own nabe.
Is that childrens’ park enclosure bulletproof? Do armed guards keep crackheads a safe distance from the kiddies?
So, according to your logic, I guess the only way to avoid your child being a Howard Hughes-esque recluse is to raise said child in a high-rise condo surrounded by the grittiness, diversity and unpredictability of a crappy, er, “up-and-coming” neighborhood (with Overtown a mere stone’s throw away).
OMG
Rentertom is missing. I hope he is ok. I guess he has been busy putting on his inflation hedges with the Fed printing new money and all.
And Brickell Key has about as much ambiance as Aventura. UGH!
What is particularly interesting/RIDICULOUS about the development IS THE POOL. It’s completely covered by the structure – – WHO GOES TO MIAMI TO HANG OUT AT A COMPLETELY SHADED POOL ? The only way that pool could get direct sunlight is if the developer were to import it! HAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!
I believe that RENTER TOM is away on an extended boat cruise.Last time we were in contact, he was renting a 70 ft. yacht and cruising around Bahamas and some of the outer islands.He will be back soon.
While not a recluse, but I love the idea of living on Brickell Key. A secluded island would be great. My only real gripe is the lack of amenities available on the island directly. Perhaps somebody from the area could summarize what is available on the island-restaurants, coffee shops, etc. Otherwise, Brickell is a very short walk away. Problem is there is very little in that area as well. In fact, does a starbucks even exist in Brickell yet? Brickell is a short infusion of entrepreneurs away from having a very nice standard of living. Keep the costs reasonable and a coffee shop, restaurant/diner, and bookstore would flourish in the area. But if they continue to try and put in $50 a meal restaurants, the boom/bust cycle will continue. AFFORDABILITY is the key to long term profitability for businesses in these areas.
Kramer and Simple Simon: Am out of the country again. No cruises for me…prefer the full island experience instead of stop overs. Although I will probably do a a short cruise this year…prices are really really great so just hop on one the last minute.
Don’t know about these “theme” buildings….nice, but might grow tired of it after a while unless it was part of Disney World or Vegas. Seriously, what are we going to see next, an “It’s a Small World” ride or something??? I guess that was part of the real estate bubble. Theme buildings……hmmmmm.
gables:
On the island is a neat restaurant, The Brasserie, that serves international cuisine, though there is a heavy Italian influence. There is the Islander Market, a grocery/convenience store that also serves food and has a sandwich shop. The small shops on the island include a dry cleaner, Swire Real estate a travel agency, a beauty salon and florist (the owner of the salon also owns the florist shop) and, last but not least, a wine bar. I would note that the last time I looked the wine bar was not doing well financially and the rumor was that the owner was desperately trying to sell.
Is there a Starbucks on the island: certainly not. But there is one in Mary Brickell village.
It’s funny how different people’s taste can be. Most of the commenters seem to like this building, but I find it particularly ugly on the outside. That Asian pointy roof looks cheap and out of place in Miami. Is that green plastic on the roof? I’m not saying you can’t do Asian design well in Miami, but I think you have to reserve it for the interiors like the Setai successfully did. Plus this thing is so expensive too.
Horrible images – just hurts eyes to watch;
And the watermark are just way too cheesy – there has to be a better way of doing it
I can see Asia from my window (saves 1.1 Million)
scrivener, thanks for the info.
I heard someone got killed in pace park today. I want to hear what AJ has to say about this.
Anyways, I really like this building. Brickell Key is a great place.
Classic.
2005 Miami New Times
BEST HOMELESS HANGOUT Margaret Pace Park 1745 N. Bayshore Drive
With its panoramic view of Biscayne Bay, its relatively new sod and working public restrooms, Margaret Pace Park is a bum’s paradise. You can hop on the nearby Metromover for a quick excursion to Camillus House for some grub. You can take a stroll down the scenic Venetian Causeway. But best of all, the waterfront park’s sculptures and park benches provide just the right amount of cover to allow for hassle-free indulgences that are no one else’s business anyhow — a swig from that bulging bottle of Colt 45, a puff on the old crack pipe.
http://www.miaminewtimes.com/bestof/2005/award/best-homeless-hangout-42682/
JoeBob:
Agreed! Honestly the building should never have been built in the first place. Originally the plot of land upon which it sits was slated to be a round-about that connected to the Carbonell. But someone got greedy and greed usually turns to stupidity. And thus Miami has Asia – – an architectural disaster area.
Having watched the building go up – – I have to say that you couldn’t pay me to own in it, let alone live in it. One of the dirty secrets that most people don’t know is that construction was halted for three months. When construction reached to floor that covers the pool – – – someone figured out that the architects had not done the math correctly. So they had to go back to the drawing board and re-engineer the structure so that it would hold the weight. My sources tell me that this meant trippling the amount of concrete and steel used. (For those of you keeping score here: yes the building is probably top heavy and for this reason I am dying to see how it survives a category 3 or 4 hurricane. BRING IT ON!!)
My sources also tell me that roughly 60 percent of those who purchased pre-construction walked away from their deposits. Those that actually closed are now stuck with a condo with an inflated cost basis which they are trying to rent out.
Oh the drama.
As someone living next to Pace Park for almost a year and a half, I’m surprised and annoyed by the comments about the park. I am a female who walks my dog everyday at 6:30 am (still dark out) and in the evening and have NEVER felt threatened by anyone else in the park. Most people respect others and pick up after their pets. It is obviously well-liked, as parking is always hard to find, and between 5-8, every part of the park is being used. It is truely sad that people in this day are so ignorant to suggest that homeless=dangerous. The few homeless that hang out (and are not there everyday) have never bothered me. A murder did occur yesterday in the early afternoon. But until I receive more information (i.e., Was it an isolated incident?, Was it an act towards a specific person?, etc.), I would not be stupid enough to make a judgment that the Pace Park area is now dangerous and I should never go there. Murders have recently occurred in South Beach, yet no one comments on how unsafe that area is…
“Murders have recently occurred in South Beach, yet no one comments on how unsafe that area is…”
Go jogging!
Sharonephone,
I called up my friends in 1800 and they told me that a homeless person died yesterday.
They went down to investigate and talked to cops but no one knows yet the cause of death. It may or may not be an attack. If I find out more, I will post.
From what I gather from some of these posts, there are some disturbed individuals who are taking sick pleasure out of such stories. I will not be surprised if these are the same types that watch snuff films or dog fights. Every right thinking person should express total revulsion towards this kind of people.
AJ said: “I called up my friends in 1800 and they told me that a homeless person died yesterday.
They went down to investigate and talked to cops but no one knows yet the cause of death.”
+++++++++++++++++++++++++
Probably just an investor in Condos-R-Us (Corus) Bank. As “scrivener’s error” said: “Oh the drama”
Today’s Business Journal:
http://southflorida.bizjournals.com/southflorida/stories/2009/04/06/daily15.html?ed=2009-04-07&ana=e_du_pub
Tuesday, April 7, 2009, 1:13pm EDT | Modified: Tuesday, April 7, 2009, 4:06pm
Nearly all of Corus’ South Florida condo loans in trouble
South Florida Business Journal – by Brian Bandell
Its strategy of funding dozens of condo construction projects in South Florida has gone horribly wrong for Corus Bankshares, which announced that nearly all of its $1.1 billion in loans to South Florida projects were impaired at year-end.
In its 2008 earnings release late Monday, the Chicago-based bank (NASDAQ: CORS) said it lost $456.5 million last year, and its ability to continue operating as a “going concern” is in doubt.
Corus ended the year with 17 loans to South Florida condo construction and rental apartment projects with a total value of $1.11 billion. Of these, the bank said 13, with a total value of $1.01 billion, were nonaccrual. Two more loans valued at a total of $55 million were classified as potential problem loans – meaning they were performing, but the bank had serious doubts about the ability of the borrowers to repay those loans.
That means 96 percent of Corus’ South Florida condo and rental apartment loans were experiencing a significant problem at year-end. Only two South Florida loans, with a total value of $40 million, were not cited in the bank’s annual report.
The bank has outstanding loans on 3,059 completed and under-construction units in South Florida. It said that 2,685 were in projects with nonaccrual loans.
For the entire bank, slightly more than half of Corus’ total $4.05 billion in loans were nonperforming at year-end.
Corus said that all five of its condo projects under construction in South Florida had nonaccrual loans at year-end. According to court records, the projects still under construction as of Dec. 31 were:
* Fortune International’s Jade Ocean Condominiums in Sunny Isles Beach, which has a $288.1 million mortgage.
* RPC Holdings’ Paramount Bay in Miami, which has a $216 million mortgage.
* Key International Development’s The Mint at Riverfront in Miami, which has a $191.8 million mortgage.
* Roy Stillman Organization’s Trump International Hotel and Tower in Fort Lauderdale, which has a $139 million mortgage.
* ATM Holding Corp.’s Dolcevita Luxury Oceanfront Condominium in Palm Beach Shores, which has a $34.2 million mortgage.
In order to help cover construction overruns, Corus has funded loans when developer funds weren’t available to continue work on projects. The bank said it funded $36 million to four nonaccrual South Florida condo loans in 2008 to cover overruns.
Last year, Corus also gained control through foreclosure of one South Florida project– the Tao condo in Sunrise. It valued the 396-unit building at $81 million, and said it planned to complete construction and sell units off individually.
Yet, more Corus foreclosures are coming.
Corus said it has started the process of foreclosing on three condo loans in South Florida with a total balance of $199 million. These projects were not identified.
A search of court filings did not find any pending Corus foreclosures against its South Florida projects. However, the bank noted that it sometimes tries to work through borrowers and mezzanine lenders to secure a deed in lieu of foreclosure, which does not require a lawsuit. That’s how it gained control over Tao.
Corus said it would consider bulk sales, selling individual units or conversion to rental in the condo projects it forecloses on.
The main source of trouble for Corus’ condo projects has been tepid sales.
“Unit sales of condominium buildings are typically a borrower’s sole source of funds to repay our loan,” Corus stated in its earning report. “In the absence of unit sales, the cost to carry the completed building can quickly overwhelm the borrower’s resources. Unless additional funds are forthcoming, this can quickly result in the bank classifying the loan as nonaccrual, and may ultimately result in foreclosure. During 2008, Corus has seen many instances where borrowers could no longer support their loan or where the collateral no longer exceeds the company’s exposure.”
With $8.35 billion in assets at year-end, Corus is under pressure from a regulatory order to improve its capital position and manage its problem loans. The bank ended the year with $2.04 billion in nonperforming loans. It charged off $409 million in 2008 due to problem loans, leaving it with a reserve for future loan losses of $305 million. The bank warned that losses in its loan portfolio that exceed that reserve could further erode its capital base.
In a February agreement with federal regulators, Corus was told to raise its capital ratio levels by mid-July or face further action. The bank’s survival is at stake.
“To the extent that the current conditions in the housing market and the general economy continue or worsen, the level of problem assets and losses is likely to increase, which could result in the bank being placed into conservatorship or receivership, or force the company to liquidate or reorganize,” Corus stated in its earnings report. “If we are unable to return to profitability and if we are unable to identify and execute a viable strategic alternative, we may be unable to continue as a going concern.”
Should Corus go into receivership, it is likely that the Federal Deposit Insurance Corp. would take control of its assets, including its loans to South Florida condo projects.
AJ
Have you moved into 50 Biscayne yet?
Sharonephone said, “A murder did occur yesterday in the early afternoon. But until I receive more information (i.e., Was it an isolated incident?, Was it an act towards a specific person?, etc.), I would not be stupid enough to make a judgment that the Pace Park area is now dangerous and I should never go there.”
Sorry but a MURDER is a MURDER, not matter how you try to sugarcoat it. You’re using parks where murders and homelessness take place, in Miami, one of the most violent cities in the WORLD. Your overpriced property has just dropped 20% in value because of that MURDER.
AJ shows us the money. No excuses , no fantasies on blogs, SHOW US THE MONEY. Money talks. Anyone who has to rent rooms in someone else’s condo shouldn’t be trying to talk money. Can’t you afford an hotel in Miami? Again, no BS justifications, no excuses, you aren’t fooling anyone who actually runs businesses, have degrees in finance, and have been around the block a few. SHOW US THE MONEY!
Un-Related:
WOW! And yet, not surprising. Thanks for the great find!
My advice: hold your nose because South Florida is going under!
AJ commented, “From what I gather from some of these posts, there are some disturbed individuals who are taking sick pleasure out of such stories. I will not be surprised if these are the same types that watch snuff films or dog fights. Every right thinking person should express total revulsion towards this kind of people.”
AJ, the “disturbed” individuals are very likely only taking pleasure in the fact that their perception/description of Pace Park is much more accurate than that which you are attempting to portray. Pace Park is not the Miami-mini-Central Park you describe in your posts; the great location where residents can have the “time of their lives.” It might be a wonderful location in 10 years. But for now, it’s just a wonderful location for crack (and apparently murder, as well – so pack your heater if you happen to get lost in that part of town).
So anyway, I gonna go watch two yorkies fight to the death. The video store was out of snuff films… Now, THAT is revolting.
Homeless people are a huge part of Miami and Miami Beach crime statistics. Many of the murders that take place Miami Beach involve homeless people. Just a few weeks ago a homeless man was sliced up. Miami Beach is better at shoving it under the rug. Miami Beach is also a hot spot for fugitives who are wanted for murder.
One of the joys of being a tourist destination is that all this stuff gets swept under the rug. Plea deals, no long trials and a friendly media. Pace Park doesn’t have that luxury.
Aj, for once in your life have some intellectual integrity and admit that the murder is a net negative for 1800 club.
In other news the splendidly appointed 1807 (precious 7 line) has fallen to an asking rent of 2k. Uh oh!!!!! This drops the value of your unit to less than 320k. Wait until the exodus occurs after word of the bum slaying gets out.
Marina blue looks much nicer by the way
JW-
Before making assumptions next time, I do not own a property in the Pace Park area. I do not have a preconceived need to defend my “investment”, I am merely trying to defend an area in which I have enjoyed renting and living in for the past 1.5 years.
According to Forbes.com (11/07), the most murderous cities in the US are:
1. Detroit
2. Baltimore
3. New Orleans
4. Newark
5. St Louis
6. Oakland
7. Washington DC
8. Cincinnati
9. Philadelphia
10. Buffalo
infoplease.com lists 25 most dangerous cities in the US and Miami is not listed there.
And according to foriegnpolicy.com, the most murderous cities in the world are:
1. Caracas, Venezuela
2. Capetown, South Africa
3. New Orleans, US
4. Moscow, Russia
5. Port Moresby, Papua New Guinea
I understand that measures for these types of lists differ depending on the source. Can you provide the list that has Miami as one of the most murderous cities in the world?
Listen, I agree that a murder is a murder. Am I more concerned now than I was on Monday morning? Of course. However, that doesn’t mean you blanket an area as a result of one occurrence. One of my favorite shopping areas in one of the safest cities in South FL, Boca Town Center, had 2 kidnappings/murders occur in the last couple of years. Does this mean I avoid the area completely now? No, I am just more careful when I shop there.
While opinions can be interesting and insightful, they are no good unless they are backed up by some evidence. My evidence was that I have spent 1.5 years daily in the Pace Park and have yet to experience or see someone else experience a negative event, much less a violent one. Please do your research before stating your opinions.
Go walk around the new South Pointe Park in South Beach, or even the park in front of Ocean Drive. They make Pace Park look like Baghdad. If the City of Miami would spend just half the money they are spending for that Museum Park, then it would look much better. Instead, Pace will continue to look like the back lot of a run down school yard for a few decades.
Folks:
I don’t know if this is to obvious an observation, but has anyone noticed that the Asia unit photographed on this site is not finished: the floor is concrete. Looks to me like another investor has bought the dust?
scrivener’s error said: “the Asia unit photographed on this site is not finished”
************
Project Manager, Mr. Hung Far Lo, noted that it is normal for a unit to look this way after the Chinese drywall has been removed. He further stated there are three times the number of this type of unit at the ICON Brickell.
Sharonephone said, “According to Forbes.com (11/07), the most murderous cities in the US are…Can you provide the list that has Miami as one of the most murderous cities in the world?”
Sure thing, here’s a list from the FBI (better credibility than your source), showing 2007 violent crime rates. Do you see a big difference?
City………………Population………..Crimes
1. Detroit………….860,971…………….2,289
2. Baltimore………624,237…………….1,631
3. Newark…………280,158……………..853
4. St. Louis………..348,197……………..2,198
5. Oakland…………396,541……………..1,918
6. Washington……588,292…………….1,347
7. Cincinnati………332,388…………….1,079
8. Philadelphia……1,435,533…………..1,475
9. Buffalo……………273,832…………….1,275
Miami………………..410,252……………..1,492
Do you see how you’re trying to sugarcoat it, again? Nice try, though. Now I let you go back to hang out in parks where MURDERS take place.
*New Orleans wasn’t on the list.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_cities_by_crime_rate
Anyone have any details on the Pace Park murder? I left work early on Monday and was driving home on Bayshore and the cops had the whole basketball court area roped off in yellow tape, couple crime scene vans, tons of cop cars, etc. A saw a bunch of people who must have lived in 1800 or Q gathered around looking too.
I agree, this isn’t good for the reputation of the area.
AJ,
Are you in Maimi?
Nothing like a murder in the park to bring some action to the hood. I stand by me prvious statements. This place is just too close to the hood to be any good.
Can’t wait to see this one on the First 48.
Un-Related: Good call!
JW-
You replied with a list of cities with violent crime rates, not most muderous cities, like you first suggested.. Also, I believe the forbes.com list took data from the FBI as well.
“And a comparison of the 72 American cities with a population over 250,000, using data from the Federal Bureau of Investigation’s Uniform Crime Reporting Program, reveals that some places are definitely more murderous than others. ”
http://www.forbes.com/2007/11/08/murder-city-danger-forbeslife-cx_de_1108murder.html
Again with the doing your research first (and properly based on your own suggestions), then commenting….
I have no incentive to sugarcoat anything. I’m just trying to give my honest opinion b/c I have appreciated others who have done the same on here. The park works well for me and apparently many others. If you don’t want to use it, don’t.
I apologize JW, you said one of the most violent cities in the world, not US… so I’ll wait for that list…
South Pointe Park——-Miami Beach spent twenty million this time on top of the three million that was spent on the last renovation. South Pointe Park was redesigned it to make it less friendly to roving pit bulls, homeless people and gangs. Continuum and Apogee owners will be the first to witness if the park has changed. If conditions don’t improve look for a massive amount of sales from this area. People who spends millions will not put up with the quality of life issues that go on in this area. Pace Park doesn’t have the police force to deal with these issues and will become more of a hindrance to the neighborhood than an asset.
Pace Park
You know I have to agree with AJ on this one. You guys – JW- Wild Bill- Gt3- Avb- Angel – etc. – Seem to evoke a perverse sense of delight when this issue first came up. Your manic and rabid response and then description of a city of debauchery under seige with crime as JW says – “One of The Most Violent Cities in The World” – begs the question as to why you all live here with it being such a rat hole? Seems to me you would pack your bags and families and head to the safety of New York or Chicago or Detroit or Baltimore. Why in the world do put up with all this mayhem?
Lara,
I will be there on Tuesday.
I feel sorry for all these guys gloating over nothing. For almost two weeks, there is nothing negative on the market. There is positive news on all fronts. These guys are frustrated and grinding their teeth. This non issue came and these desperate guys are clutching to this story like a drowning sailor clutches to a straw.
OK, you guys can have some fun. I don’t want to throw cold water on your once in a year orgasm.
Throughout the past, Miami stories about car jackings or killings of European tourists made super big headlines across the pond from Manchester to Munich. That did nothing to dim the European love affair with Miami. And by the way CSI Miami is no.1 crime show in most of the World. They actually believe there is a murder a day in Miami like the show portrays. But still Miami is most popular wishful destination for the rest of the World among US destinations after Las Vegas and Orlando.
Why don’t you pussies all collectively exit my beloved city and go live in Timbuktu if you are so afraid of living in Miami. We will gladly keep an exclusive lane open for you on North Bound I 95.
Wow! I did not read Kramers #72 before I wrote my post #73. But I sure concur.
It is striking as to why some of these gentlemen put up with the “hell on Earth” that is Miami. Why run the place to ground while waiting like a jackal for a price cut on a unit to buy!! Unbelievable, unethical and unforgivable.
Lucas,
The cheerleaders are in need of a dose of reality. How about the latest Closing Numbers?
That should do it.
AJ,
I will be in Miami in 1 week. If you want to speak or meet I sent to Lucas all my info.
Thanks Lara. I will be in Miami for 1 month. You can always reach me by e-mail at [email protected]
I might be a RE bear for Miami, but i must agree too much negativity is being thrown at Pace Park. Agreed it is not Central Park, but it never claimed to be either. Are there strange and unsightly people in the area? Sure. But walk down the Miracle Mile in Coral Gables at night-one of the “upscale” regions of the area. The homeless are found in front of many shops and benches. In fact Coral Gables has had its share of “murders” through the years as well. Is this also a dangerous and bad part of Miami? This is a part of life in Miami, and in fact many southern cities. If you cannot accept it, perhaps you would be wise to move elsewhere. Because none of our griping will change it in the near or long term. While i am not convinced pace park is a reason to buy in that area, it certainly is not a reason to avoid the area.
Unrelated,
I don’t know if you are referring to me as the cheerleader. Just to clarify, I am not cheer leading anything. I am just trying to debunk some scare mongering.
I very well know the ground reality. The latest closing numbers will not say anything new that we already don’t know. No one is selling and no one is buying. Everything is standstill.
Let the nature take its course is all I am saying. If one can buy a flat in ICON or Marquis in a public auction for pennies on the dollar, so be it. But no need to resort to scare mongering and talk rubbish about Park West or Downtown or Pace Park or any other place for that matter.
AJ,
I thought for a fleeting moment that you were going to conclude your post in the manner in which you started it…..civilly and without unnecessary commentary. I was in error.
What is the purpose of: “But no need to resort to scare mongering and talk rubbish about Park West or Downtown or Pace Park or any other place for that matter.”
I said NOTHING about Park West, Downtown, or Pace Park. They are what they are and I will leave it at that. My posts were on Corus Bank and Condo Closing Numbers. Period.
That said, you are more likely to find a gaggle of ACORN Obamunists residing on the West side of Biscayne Bay…………
Any color on Bentley Bay South/North? Each bldg has a unit for ~300k. High floors. I know HOA is high & valet only but theses do seem like good deals for a luxury building on 5th & West in South Beach. All units have full on bay views. I also think they allow monthly rentals. Any feedback appreciated.
i have not read a single comment. are we generic as a society or aren’t we?
unrelated,
I definitely did not have you in mind when I said “But no need to resort to scare mongering and talk rubbish about Park West or Downtown or Pace Park or any other place for that matter.” I was lamenting about those who did earlier on in this thread.
la la!!
I am confused! What does that mean? anyway good to hear from you.
seanjohn,
Are they 1 br or 2 br? 300k for 1 br may not be a great deal at this time. But I may be wrong. More details please.
AJ
They are 1/1’s. They are the two “wave-like” towers on the left as you drive over McArthur Cswy. All units have full bayfront views. One of these units traded with a six handle in 2006. The bldg has the bad luck to have closed in 2006 at the height. I have visited once & units are really nice, soaking tubs, bidets, Miele appliances. To me these are the cheapest waterfront South Beach lux units.
I know the 2 Bentleys well. Actually it is more like a sail than a wave. They had major balcony problems. Last heard it is still a bit iffy. Valet only is a major turn off. But if it is just your vacation home and you are mostly in SOBE, it may be OK for some. But still, Neither Ocean Drive nor Lincoln road is close by to walk. One saving grace is that the 25 cent jitney stops in front of the building. With the 5th and Alton at your door step, it may be a very convenient location for you as I heard that a publix will be in that mall.
A small baywalk connects you to Floridian. In the evenings it is a gorgeous place to be. If you cross the MacArthur then you are at the ICON/Murano Marina. Another great place to walk and you can also walk to south pointe park along the same route.
The views are great. But I would recommend north tower to avoid the whirring and whizzing and honking of the traffic on the Causeway (it might get even worse once 5th and Alton opens up). Good Luck!
That all these projects are starting to blend into one generic blob to me…the only one that was slightly unique was icon brickell. otherwise all these buildings are interchangeable with their boring white stucco exteriors, blue glass balconies, their lobbies and their amenities…yawwwwwnnnnn.
AJ
Thanks for the feedback. Agree on the valet only. I think that maybe over 35% is for sale which is uncharacteristically high for that location. That still may not preclude it being a good buy in the high two’s though. Re “sail” versus “wave”, check 🙂
Sharonephone said, “You replied with a list of cities with violent crime rates, not most muderous cities, like you first suggested.. ”
Do you realize that the FBI considers VIOLENT CRIME as a combination of MURDER + MANSLAUGHTER + FORCIBLE RAPE? So which one of those three violent crimes makes you feel better than murder? Do you prefer rape or manslaughter to feel better walking alone at your Miami parks?
As you can see by the FBI list, and taking into consideration populations, Miami should be up there within the first five most violent in the country.
The numbers don’t lie, not matter how much you try to sugarcoat it. And anyone who took basic statistics in college knows how to read those alarming numbers. Oh and BTW, that list was waayyy before the financial collapse in Florida, so imagine what the stats must be now.
sharonephone said, “I apologize JW, you said one of the most violent cities in the world, not US… so I’ll wait for that list…”
CIA’s murder rate for the top 5 most violent countries:
Rank……Countries………Murders Per Capita
# 1……….Colombia………62 per 100,000 people
# 2………South Africa…..50 per 100,000 people
# 3………Jamaica…………32 per 100,000 people
# 4………Venezuela………31 per 100,000 people
# 5………Russia……………20 per 100,000 people
?………….Miami……………20 per 100,000 people
I separated the rape and manslaughter cases from the Miami stats, just taking the murder cases into account. According to the FBI list, Miami had 78 murders in 2007. Please note that I’m not including Miami Beach (4 murders) + Miami Gardens (24) + Miramar (7) + North Miami (9) + Plantation (4) + Palmetto Bay (1) + Coral Gables (1) + Hialeah (7 murders), even though the people from these areas hang out where you do.
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_mur_percap-crime-murders-per-capita
Asia is beautiful to look at from the outside, but judging by the inside pictures I am very happy i bought next door at Courvoisier Courts. did my own rennovations and ended up with a much better result for half the price.
Pace Park, this park, that park! Who cares? The smart ones don’t realize that crime is happening within the county as a whole. Miami Dade County that is. Yet, the commentators on this blog can’t wait to put on their sunglasses, flip flops, head to the beach with the top down, while calling your friends back at home telling them “what a great time I’m having”. Don’t rag on my parks or local cities. If you hate it so much, pack your crap and go home! And don’t forget, South Beach, Brickell and downtown Miami are all the same. Yet -you all can’t wait to buy or rent your next big Miami property! If this city is not for you because you saw a crime then leave. I saw the dead body from my balcony and to me it was just another beautiful day in the Magic City! I lived in this city for 35 years. Went to school to IFAC in the 80s. Pace Park was not a place for little AJ back then. Several of us worked hard for many years to make it better. Today 6 high rises and young professional enjoy this park. It is remarkable, I hope you all take care of it and enjoy it. What’s coming next to Biscayne Blvd will blow your minds in years to come.
AJ – don’t be scare sweetheart, walk the streets, grow up.
Love this building! Love it! Although it does have tight competition against the Four Seasons Hotel & Tower in Downtown. When I am the mood for a penthouse, I will look at both of these because I love them both!
Giovanni Armani Nyzo
Miami, Florida