Marina Blue – A Look Inside Biscayne Boulevard’s Newest Condo Development

Lucas… The pictures are beautiful!! I don’t live in the Miami area so it’s great to have a visual! I really appreciate all the work you do on your blog. It is very informative on what is going on in that area. Keep up the great work!!

Nice pics! I wanted to see the building in Feb but couldn’t get in. How does Marina Blue compare to Ten Museum? Will 900 prices be similiar to Marina and Ten?

Lucas,

What do you think prices at MB per square foot should be going for in your opinion in this market as of now.

For example the 01 Line.

Sorry to be off-topic, but this is disturbing. The County just posted March statistics for foreclosure filings. Here are the numbers:

2002 14,567
2003 11,605
2004 9,606
2005 7,829
2006 9,814
2007 26,391
2008
January 3,434
February 3,721
March 4,238

For those interested in owning on that block. You had better go to http://aaarena.com and click on event calender. Ask your real estate agent to show you a unit thirty minutes before an event starts. I guarantee if you take your car you will never come back.

I agree with the 900 versus Marina Blue comparo. 900 layouts make more sense although Marina Blue has a much nicer curb appeal. However, the developers are just flooding way too many units into it at once. Ten Museum, Marina Blue, 900 Biscayne, Marquis are adding what, 1,500 “luxury” condos into 5 blocks of an “up and coming area”? Next door, Everglades is getting ready to release an additional 870 units? Remember, the flipping game is over so that means 2,400 well-off families are going to have to decide to move across the street from Bongo’s over the next couple… Read more »

perez those numbers are misleading, the situation is probably much worse. Not sure if this was already posted: April 4 (Bloomberg) — Banks are so overwhelmed by the U.S. housing crisis they’ve started to look the other way when homeowners stop paying their mortgages. The number of borrowers at least 90 days late on their home loans rose to 3.6 percent at the end of December, the highest in at least five years, according to the Mortgage Bankers Association in Washington. That figure, for the first time, is almost double the 2 percent who have been foreclosed on. Lenders who… Read more »

Has anyone heard an update about a pipe bursting on the 29th floor last night soaking a significant number of units and common areas causing quite a bit of damage at 50 Biscayne?

I heard their answer was heavy duty fans. lol

I know when the fire sprinkler pipe burst at the Opera Tower, they had a considerable amount of work, inspectors for mold, completely replaced carpets, sheet rock etc and extensive renovation that was completed from the 19th floor down to the twelfth.

Thx

I’ve wondered about that too Wild Bill. Traffic for all the Heat games and concerts has to be like madness around 6:30 every night. Then again at 10pm.

i will tell you right now that biscayne during the season pushes me to the verge of tears. really, the nights i decide to take biscayne to 395…as i turn the corner from my building onto biscayne i’m praying that i don’t end up in a parking lot. hell, even in the morning, biscayne absolutely sucks.

Wild Bill,

There is definitely a lot of traffic when there are events at night. However, in time, once Miami becomes more urbanized, this will actually be an attraction. It’ll be nice to be able to walk to events, night clubs, shops and restaurants. It’ll take quite some time, but that’s why I feel Park West has a lot of upside. Once the planned relocation of the local homeless shelter takes place, I think we’ll see Park West finally come into its own.

Lucas,
Great Blog!

I’ve had a few homeless people in Park West tell me that would rather sleep outside than risk being in that dangerous shelter. The shelter will move, but I don’t expect many homeless to vacate Park West. I’m not sure many people who needed the shelter actually used it.
Can anyone tell me any names of any retail stores or restaurants that plan on opening on ground floor of these condos or in the nearby area?

Wild Bill,

I’ve heard from several people, a few months ago, that Gardner’s Market was very close to signing a lease at 900 Biscayne Bay. That will fill a big void if it proves to be true.

Wild Bill,

I disagree. Some of the homeless may not use the shelter to sleep, but I’m pretty sure that they use the shelter to acquire a free meal. Once the shelter moves, I think most of the homeless will relocate themselves to be closer to their meal ticket.

Lucas, Thanks for the beautiful pics. I do have my eyes set on the 08 line (not the 01 line) in Marina Blue. With prices the way they are, I would not touch it though. At least not now. Lucas, can you please tell me what is the price per SF on that unit at preconstruction and was the project announced in 03/04 or 05? With the realtors accusing many of us of talking bubble too much, how about lets talk something positive? My question is why dont we post as to which are our favourite buildings that are coming… Read more »

The following was reported in the Miami Sunpost regarding a recent auction of units at Ten Museum Park, some of you may be able to identify the specific units:

Miami-Dade properties included two penthouses at Ten Museum Park in downtown Miami, not previously offered for sale. A starting bid of $1 million failed to reach the opening reserve for a three-story, 2,500-square-foot unit with 1,800-square-foot terrace. Nor were there bidders starting at $2.5 million (below reserve) for a 5,400-square-foot plus 1,800-square-foot-terrace penthouse. However, acceptable offers for the units came in after the auction.

AJ I agree with you. We are not blindly down on the RE market in Miami, just the price. We have some great buildings and great up and coming neighborhoods. In order to fulfill the potential of these buildings and neighborhoods, prices must drop to attract the people. Typical new buildings at the $250-$300 psf range will begin to attract attention. True luxury buildings probably at $400 psf. At those prices, the people will come. Otherwise people will feel they are overpaying, and even 5% overpaying on a $400k condo is too much for most to stomach at $20k. unless… Read more »

Wow…that’s impressive Perez….I think 10 Museum Park is my favorite building in Miami…
It would be nice to walk to work every morning.

Where are all these people that make 120K + a year? I just can’t figure out that rational….
I never thought that making less than 80K could out price the middle class.

I live in Canada and everytime I visit Miami (love the vibe and the beaches) I have a burning desire to buy a property. Although, when I return back home and I read articles about the US real estate economy and how the housing prices have not bottomed out, and prices are likely to come down for some time, I hesitate and wonder, do these economists know something that I don’t. The point is that prices have fallen and will continue to fall, but will the prices of today become tomorrow’s nightmare? Do you have any comments? Lucas, love your… Read more »

AJ,

I live right across from Margaret Pace Park, and I personally refer to the area as Edgewater. Officially, the City of Miami calls it Wynwood/Edgewater, but I think the latter name will stick as time goes on. This will particularly be the case once Paramount Bay is complete, with its small retail/commercial component that is to be called Edgewater Square. I love the neighborhood. It feels like an urban village, and sometimes you forget that Biscayne is but a block away.

perez ,

Those are big numbers, but I wonder where all those properties get listed afterwards, I’m been checking the MLS for a couple of ZIP codes and I do not see that many REO listed in MLS.

do you know another way to get the listing of those foreclosured properties?

Great site. Do you know how many have closed and how many have walked at Marina Blue? Anybody know how many lawsuits are under way to recover deposits? Any resales lately and, if so, how much per foot? Has the developer resold any of the defaulted inventory?

87 condos at Marina Blue have closed so far. There can be a 2-3 week delay though so the number is likely over 100.

Those buildings along Biscayne are dramatic and lovely. However, I can only imagine what life will be like there when events are taking place at AAA, Bayfront Park, etc. I have a friend who bought a place at Loft 2. I went to check out the apartment with him on a Friday night. We went up to the rooftop pool. There happened to be some musical event at the Bayfront Amphitheater, and you could hear the music on the pool deck. Mind you, this is a couple of blocks IN from the Boulevard, so I can only imagine how much… Read more »

LUCAS and WILD BILL, sort of on the fence regarding the traffic. if i lived in that area, i’d be ok with it because as Lucas mentioned, it could be ok having some hustle and bustle in the area (but i can see it be annoying after a while…especially if it bring people from hialeah, etc entering these areas and crapping all over them…IF this happens). I went to a Heat game last season and it was so horrendous that i left at the start of the 3rd quarter and it was still terrible leaving the area. they close down… Read more »

Richard, Thanks for clarifying the name. I think Edgewater sounds better. Hope it sticks. I am not sure where I will end up buying at this point. Park West seems a bit pricey. Gables, You seem like a Brickell guy. I did not do much research on that. But this is my gameplan or rather my strategy. If the units in a preconstruction building is sold by the developer to the public: at 2003 prices – I am willing to pay close to those prices. at 2004 prices – I will wait for a 20% discount. at 2005 prices –… Read more »

Neither of the two units at Ten Museum Park are REOs.

Lucas, Thanks for the MarinaBlue pics. I’m a buyer/investor there and very excited. When you have time, would have the chance to give a shot from the North East tower? That’s where I’m buying and the views are amazing as well. I’m a fully informed investor and know the Midtown and Dowtown areas back and forth, and without going into details, I see a huge upgrade in the near-future Park West. One correction to your post… MarinaBlue closed 200 units so far – not 87. I have been in close contact with the primary sources. Thanks for a great blog.… Read more »

AJ – It just seems that in this market, with high holding costs (since no income tax which hits out of staters harder), pricing could probably fall below 2003 prices as this thing unfolds. A big indicator will be what the market it like toward the end of the hurricane season….in my mind around that time we should get a sense as to where this market it headed over the next 2 years. My sense is prices will decline further over the next 2 years but the magnitude of the decline is uncertain…it could be a shallow further decline or… Read more »

Brahm,

I’ll try to get some shots from a high floor in the NE tower next time I’m in the building.

I get the closing numbers from public records. Like I said, there can be a 2-3 week delay. I actually spoke with someone at Marina Blue a little while ago and they did confirm that they’ve closed around 200 units. That’s amazing! I thought 87 units was good. 200 is outstanding!

Homeless issue in Park West should really be a 2-3 year issue. The city recently approved the final design for Museum Park, ppt with final design: http://www.ci.miami.fl.us/Planning/pages/urban_design/Bicentennial.asp, and it has now moved up to the next step. MAM has said that they will be ready to break ground in 2009. Museum of Science is also getting their funding in place. So, it all seems to be real. Once the new park and museums are in place, the City will have to help relocate the shelter. Long term value of this area is great, denying it would be short-sighted. My question… Read more »

Cyrus said: “I went to a Heat game last season and it was so horrendous that i left at the start of the 3rd quarter and it was still terrible leaving the area.” I can see that being an issue if you lived right in front of the Arena. As far as Heat games go, I’ve never had a big problem with traffic. Just don’t get on Biscayne. I take 2nd Ave off 395 to the “G3” city garage on the corner of 3rd St & 2nd Ave. It’s only $6 to park there – and plenty of spaces. It’s… Read more »

BFG,

thanks for the info re: parking. i usually go to bayside and walk over…as you can imagine, it’s a nightmare.

…and sorry for the sidebar but i have to post this because of posts from Lucas’ other posts regarding DUBAI:

guy on cnbc just said that Dubai real estate is starting to crack a la Miami as projects are starting to fall apart and ‘investors’ are stuck holding the bag. same crap, different place. i would MUCH rather buy in miami right now than dumpy Dubai!

The homeless shelter is run by Camillus House. One day their new location by Jackson Memorial might be ready. Somebody can easily drive by the new location and take pictures. Maybe it’s still an empty lot. Some of the homeless work in those parking lots for events. Don’t expect them to relocate for a free sandwich and experimental health care at Jackson. Why doesn’t somebody call the City of Miami Police Public Information Office at ask them how many new officers the City of Miami P.D. allocated to the new urbanized Park West area. It would be interesting to see… Read more »

Does anyone know what psf prices were for direct bay view units at the Waverly in 2002 and 2003? How about psf prices at the Continuum in 02 and 03? I tried to look it up on zillow.com, but was unable to find the data. thanks.

In addition to heat games, there are events at bayshore park that will generate a lot of traffic. If miami gets more urganized, there will be even more traffic and congestion. Cities like Los Angeles, Chicago, etc have heavy traffic downtown, but there are plenty of ways to get traffic in and out. I had the misfortune of going downtown to pick up a fedex package (S. Miami ave). I missed my turn and had to go around a few blocks near the court house and was amazed at how norrow the streets are and how badly traffic is managed.… Read more »

Mark. Check out this url on zillow: http://www.zillow.com/Charts.htm?chartDuration=10years&zpid=62923579

It shows a condo currently for sale for $1.2M. It sold for high 500K range in Jan 04. So it has doubled in price in last 4 years.

Prices at the Loft II are already back where they were in 2004 when the sale’s center opened.

The largest unit is line 13, a 2 bedroom with 1153 sqf. You can find a mid floor below $300k. Unit 1813 is currently listed at $290,000 that’s $251 a sqf.

Waverly when it turned condo around late 2003 was around $350 sq. foot for the best direct bay view line 01/02. It could have been $330 or $370, but not $400. Right now, the lowest 01/02 is asking $510/ft. I think. Anyway, I remember developers telling me how outrageous that was for a middle lux building and that the market couldn’t go much farther from there and everything was going to pop. Well it took another 2 years and another doubling to Pop. Basically, I doubt any property anywhere is going to get ‘safe” until it rolls back to 2002-2003.… Read more »

Lucas likes talking about how good the condo prices are in Miami. I bet he couldn’t even afford a cheap 600sq. ft. condo at the Miami district. What a shame. Grow up and admit that those condos are nothing but rip offs. Oh, nevermind, you are here for the commission. Goodluck realtor.

Joe
I don’t think you know anything about Lucas. If you followed his blog on a regular basis you would know that he tells it the way it is good or bad. If you recall just a few months ago, his honesty has even gotten him in trouble. It sounds to me like you might have some jealousy going, maybe its time you grow up.

Het let’s stick to the blog topic which was about Marina Blue not about parking or other things eveyone always wants to steer to.

carbonblackcab – thanks again. How did you navigate to the historical sales price? When I type in the address of a building into the search engine, it takes me to a page with current listings, and I can’t seem to find the historicals. Also, looking at the link you sent me, I assume the dollar sign is where/when the last transacted price was?

carbonblackcab – sorry, I just noticed the past sale information under the chart. still wondering how to navigate to that page though. thanks.

carbonblackcab – sorry again, i figured out how to navigate to the historical data. thanks.

Joe, take that bottle of milk out of your mouth and grow up…while you’re at it, remove your head from hole #2.

OnceAgain, parking in that area IS important info…especially if someone plans on living in any of those buildings.

Great article in Business week about Maimi Title: How the beach ball burst. Url: http://www.businessweek.com/magazine/content/08_16/b4080071341961.htm Story: Next Issue Christopher Silas Neal Story Tools post a comment e-mail this story print this story order a reprint digg this save to del.icio.us linkedin connections Illustrations by Christopher Silas Neal Herewith, dear readers, an account of the epic South Florida real estate boom and bust of the 2000s, as witnessed by this longtime Miamian. Please note that certain names have been changed to protect the profligate. Screenplay proposals are welcome. March, 2001. Fishing at my Uncle Gil’s house overlooking Biscayne Bay. The snapper… Read more »

Tax question:

If I buy one condo for let’s say 70% of the previous sale price, how are the taxes calculated?
Based on the new price? or in the old (or current valuation)?

thanks

How does Marina Blue compare to the others in the area, Ten Museum Park, 900 Biscayne, Marquis, etc???